caverkevin(Offline)

Hello all!!

I mentioned in another thread that Cris and I got new scooters from SUEX in Italy. I received a PM yesterday asking if I could write an option piece on the scooters. I am always more than happy to talk about dive gear . So following is a whole bunch of writing about how the scooters are built and operate.

Before the scooters, the company that builds them. SUEX submarine exploration is based out of Villorba Italy, Just a short drive north of Venice. It was founded by two men, a engineer and diver. They have a beautiful facility where they are capable of everything from designing & testing to building and shipping the scooters to the customers. Most of the products components are manufactured in-house.

The scooters are similar form to many other exploration quality scooters on the market. Tow behind, one hand controllable and modular to fit the diver's needs. This is where the designs part company with many other scooters. The Zeuxo's are also electronically controlled. These controls offer the diver variable speed controls and other very interesting features. The major scooter components were design and built specifically for this scooter. I will run through the scooter from nose to tail. Explain how it works and the strengths of the system.

The nose cone is comprised of a solid PVC dome with a hand-wheel in the center of the dome. The hand-wheel is the system of closure for the scooter. The threaded stud on the hand-wheel mates with the battery support frame. This compresses the scooter together, removing the need for external latches. The body and nose cone use barrel o-ring seals instead of a face o-ring seal. Two advantages of this are the o-rings are not exposed to dirt and particulate in the environment and the tail, body and nose a touching against solid surfaces. So the compression of the main body o-rings at depth don't cause small amounts of buoyancy change.

Inside the thick PVC tubular body is a aluminum battery support frame. This frame holds the batteries in position inside the body. A system of small adjustment wheels allow for precise and repeatable trimming of the scooter. The supports are connected to the electric motor mounts in the tail of the system.

Below the battery frame, inside the motor compartment, you find the real turning forces of the scooters. Here is where the motor, gear reduction box, circuit switch, proximity sensors, variable speed control, electronics board and low voltage alert are housed. The motor is a powerful 1Kw motor. At maximum speed is operating at less than half of the rated capacity for which the motor was design. The gear reduction simple reduces motor turning speed to increase the torque at the propeller. Recently this box has been improved to reduce the noise associated with gear reduction. Now the scooter is very quite in operation. On the exterior of the tail there is two turnable knobs, one is for "on/off" the other for speed control. There are many benefits to these two knobs. The on/off allows the scooters to be turned off, to protect against being accidently turned "on" during the dive or boat rides. Also a scooter that has failed and is running continuously, could be simple turned "off". The speed control reduces the amount of current delivered to the motor. This gives the diver easy control to match to the dive buddy's scooter speed. Also running the at reduced power greatly increase battery burn time. Then there is a low voltage siren inside the motor compartment. To warn the diver that battery voltage is getting really low. The proximity sensors that are used to trigger the electronic are from robotic applications. They are designed to long-term, repeated use.

Outside on the tail you find the trigger, handles, clutch, shaft seal and propeller. The handles are angled slightly. The angle, feels very natural in the grip. The trigger handle has large oval opening in the plastic that protects the trigger behind the hole. The hole in the handle is large enough to insert two gloved fingers. The trigger is a spring loaded linkage that controls a push-rod. The end of the rod has a small piece of stainless steel that rides up and down inside a small tunnel in the tail section, next to the proximity sensors. The trigger is very easy to set and change. Then rear shaft is another SUEX specific part. Basically creates oil lubricated, double o-ring seal around the motor shaft. While it is not a good idea to operate the scooter above the surface of water for prolonged periods, running the scooter above the surface will not put the shaft seal in immediate risk of failure. The seal is also user replaceable with a few o-ring, some mineral oil and a couple common hand tools. The prop is also a SUEX design. The blades are molded plastic. The parts that connect the blade to the center hub are very thick and durable. The blades also carry a lifetime warranty. The center hub of the prop is spring loaded against the shaft. The slip of the prop is totally adjustable by adjusting the depth of the lock-nut holding the prop to the shaft.

Then for batteries and accessories. SUEX uses both NiMH and lead-acid battery technologies in the scooters. Battery/scooter combinations range any where from 14 amp hour to 60 amp hour. They also offer variety of smart battery chargers and battery burn testers. Plus, included with all the scooters is a low voltage cut-off device. This is intended to disconnect the power supply before the batteries can be drained too low.

For service and quality of the product. They test all scooter to a depth greater than 150 meter in pressure pots before they are shipped. There are also water baths of fresh and salt water inside the factory. These are used for testing, weighting and balancing after the scooters are built. Then each scooter is weighted and trimmed for fresh water before shipment. The weighting for salt water is included with the scooter. During the few days I spent at the factory, getting my hands dirty and helping building a few scooters. I witnessed that they placed a customers scooter upgrades before working on building stock scooters for inventory.

In general, I feel these scooters are a well thought out system. Designed, built and backed up by a great team of great people. I would characterize the them as built Ford tough, fast as a race horse, easy to use & maintain as my Mac computer and more salt water resistant than a navy ship with 18 coats of paint.

You have read this far to find my option. If it reads like a well thought out sales pitch to purchase these scooters. Well it kinda is, as I am also helping SUEX to promote these scooters in France. I feel that it is important to be up front about my interests and that I am a little more than just a informed user.

Hope you enjoyed the read!! Cheers!!

Kevin

caverkevin(Offline)

Well I also figure you guys might like a little dive report.

I was able to make two dives yesterday. First was in the bay of Villefranche. The dive plan was to head out to the middle of the bay to try and find the anchors of a cruise ship that was at anchor. After about 12 minutes on the trigger, I found myself under a dark shadow of a very noisy ship. The vis was not the greatest, only a few meters. After a few minutes I had not yet found the anchors or chain. So I came off the trigger for a few moments at a depth of 68 meters to check the buoyancy of my ADV-14. Still the same as being in a few meters of water Then it was time to head back to shore and make the deco. Departed the bottom and went into instrument flight mode. Up in the water column, surrounded by blue, just flying by a depth gauge and compass. It was a bunch of fun just cruising. At the end of the 15 meter stop , could see the bottom again. Now it to finish up deco checking out little fishies Kept the scooter p on full speed the entire dive to check the burn time. Right about 50 minutes on the 14A/hr pack.

Second dive was at Cocobeach. With plan being a easy cruise around the Cap de Nice. Splashed and dialed the speed back to a easy, yet fast speed. Would say around 40 - 50 percent of maximum. So easy to just reach down to throttle back a bit to match Cris' speed. As we neared the cap, I spotted a lost SMB at 20 meters or so. Swooped in like a hawk to pick it but. Then we crossed the cap and headed out to the deeper sand beds. Looking for lost treasures Around 30 minutes into the dive we turned it for home. Chasing schools of little fishies along the way. We circled the cap on the way back. Stop to check out the dolphin statue. Then found ourselves back at the entry point about 65 minutes into the dive. We spent 10 minutes playing with skills. Two a scooter, towing a diver and such. We were also doing tricks and aerobatics. After 75 minute BT we were tired and ready to call it a night.

After diving Cris and I discussed the scooters. We both agree these are the best scooters we have ever used. Very light and powerful. They are a snap to use and control. We both love the variable speed control for buddy matching and on-the-fly changes. The ADV-14 is the perfect sized scooter for our diving. Small and light enough that Cris can carry her own scooter. Still enough power and burn time that we can use them for all our cave and deep sea diving.

OK, my finger are tired now.......Good night and cheers!!

Kevin

voodooconstant(Offline)

Great writeup. Have any pictures to go with your review?

__________________
~Matt

caverkevin(Offline)

I have been screaming busy since coming home from Italy. So I don't have personal pictures of my scooters. www.suex.it has a bunch of pics on the site. Plus there is some videos too......

neilh (Online)

Great write up Kevin, thanks for taking the time!

Am I right in thinking you've replaced your Gavin's with these now? If so, I'd be interested to know how you would compare the two (if it's possible!).

It's good to see some competition in the scooter market now though

caverkevin(Offline)

Hello Neil!!

I still have my Gavin. Still trying to find a new home for it without having to resort to auction block of Ebay. Cris and I are in the process of replacing our two Gavins with ADV-14s. The transportion of a 19Kg scooter is very different than a 37Kg scooter. This is one of the reasons for the switch.

The Gavin is a solid scooter built on the foundation of the Tekna/Mako scooter. I know from using my Gavin, I have great number of enjoyable dives in caves, on wrecks just cruising in open water. Instead of a direct Gavin to Zeuxo comparison, how about all scooters that are built from Mako motors and systems.

One I thought the Tekna DV-3X handle was perfect. It had the right angle and shape. Was comfortable hold. With the Mako handle I have never found a really great grip. Either my wrist is twisted to hold on to the trigger with my index finger or I would have to spread my index and middle finger apart to pitch the handle and trigger between the two. The handle on the Zeuxo has that natural feel and is easy to use one or two fingers to keep the trigger depressed.

I am less than impressed with the variable prop of the Mako design. Between having to stop to adjust pitch setting. Dealing with sticky yoke & screw, making hard to adjust. Thin, hollow stemmed blades that need metal pins for added strength. A mechanical clutch, that once slipped either needs to be replaced or use a dot of super glue to hold the two parts together. Placing you motor at great jeopardy.

The prop on the Zeuxo is fixed. The blades and hub and solidly fastened together. I have not tried it, but I imagine you could throw one of these props around like a ninjas star all day with out busting it. That would be really wicked with some of the experimental 5 and 7 bladed props I have seen on the test scooters and work bench at SUEX. The clutch is super simple and works. I got the tow cord stuck in the prop monday night. I heard it slip a couple of times and got off the trigger. Pulled the cord out and went back to having a good old time!

The Mako motor is a specific winding and design to achieve the correct amount of torque and RPMs. There are a total of 8 brushes held inside of a holders soldered to a circuit board. Getting a really good Tekna motor was a craps shot. Mako motors are kind plan jane and lack the power to really make you smile. The rewinds that you find in a Gavin or SS are nice. They all have a problem that one of the eight brushes can get hung up, causing more current to travel through the remaining brushes in contact with the winding. They can over head the board and cause the solid to melt or burn the board. That is pretty nasty.

In talking with Marco the engineer about the motor and brushes in the Zuexo motor. He showed me the brushes and brush holders. I think it is a much better system than a Mako brush board. Also he told me, if one of the brushes get hung up and is not in contact with the windings. The scooter is just not going to run right. You will know and not use it. Then have to find the issue causing a problem. Instead of riding the horse right into the ground. Then there is enough power to put a big grin on your face. With 22Kg of thrust out of the ADV-14 and 26Kg out of the ADV-15 and up. The horses have the power to pull a load.

Then the trigger. Inside the Mako and Tekna handles there is a system of pulleys and cable to transfer the trigger movement to a magnet and activate a reed switch. These systems can be a nightmare. That is why you want direct access to the magnet. So if needed you can grab it with you hand and turn it on or off.

With the Zeuxo there is no cable or pulley system. Just a solid, spring loaded linkage the moves a push rod. On the end of the rod is a bit of steel to activate the scooter. For some reason the trigger did not work, you can just grab the push rod.

The need for trigger pins or locks. I have always been worried leaving my Gavin just sitting in a cave. Mainly because I thought another diver my fly off with it while diving at Ginnie Springs. Also because the magnet could get bumped on. A pin or thumb screw would not stop the magnet wheel from turning. This why the after market clutches are nice because you can slip them and take the blade to a dead stall.

With the Zeuxo, just twist the "on/off" knob about a half turn and you have separated the silver contacts. The scooter is OFF! The electronics are not drawing power, if the low voltage alarm is sounding, it goes quite. So you can deactivate the scooter for transport, cache, or in the event of a problem.

Those are the items I like over the Mako systems. There are a bunch of other features that make the Zeuxo simple to control and use. The external speed control is a dream come true for me. With my buddies back in Michigan, we have talked about having a tow behind with the speed control like that of a AUL Predator. With the Zuexo it is simple to set a optimal speed and match you buddy. Then if you need to cover ground quickly, just goto 100% power. That is simple as pulling the trigger all the way back on the ADV-15 series and up. Or just turning the control all the way counter-clockwise with the ADV-14. As there is only one trigger setting in the 14, but two in all the other Zeuxo scooters. One always 100% power. The other what ever the speed control is set. The switch between the two is just a finger movement.

Man, marathon type sessions!! I don't know how to express how cool these machines are with fewer words. I have not even gotten started telling how sexy these Italian, beautiful scooter really are. They are just SEXY!!!! I have seen they are replacing the external yellow and black warning stickers with clear and white. They have a stack of new black "ZEUXO" stickers to use instead of the white. The all the internal battery frames are being coated black, instead of bare aluminum. Just make these machine even better looking. SEXY SEXY SEXY!! They are my new girlfriends! I hope Cris does not read this.

Cheers Y'all!!!

Kevin

PS, For the competition in the market place. SUEX has been building scooters for years. Since 1999 if I recall correct. So they have been here already for a while.

Rubis(Offline)

Nice try ...


It's true, these scooters are gorgeous and much fun ... We'll never dive again without
It really opens up so many opportunities for us for exploration even with "weenie" shore diving

Cheers

PS: We really need to sell the remaining Gavin, we need more cutie little petuties scooters !!!

neilh (Online)

Thanks Kevin - quite a response!

Weeell, why didn't you say! Tell you what, pop it on a plane and I'll make sure it stays nice and clean (washing it regularly) and give it some exercise for you. No need to thank me

Here's a thought, if these scooters are so nice but also much lighter - are they going to be easier to walk off with I can imagine Gavin's could get left alone cos nobody can be bother to try to "run" off with one

Be good to see some in the UK sometime - how about getting over to the DIR gathering in November to show them off?
(Especially as I can't make it so you can't tempt me! )

PBrown (Online)

Kevin,

couple of quick questions for you:

Looking at the Suex site & reading your posts above, it appears that the ADV14 is a different back end to the rest of the lineup, is this correct?

Are the back ends & bodies interchangable, i.e could I buy an ADV15 & put an ADV42 front on it?

cheers,
Paul

caverkevin(Offline)

Hello Paul!!

You are correct about the differences between the ADV-14 and the rest of the line-up. The 14 is design to be a small, light weight, 1 hour burn time scooter. The ADV-15 series are designed to be interchangeable and operate for more than one hour. There are two different diameter tubes for the all the scooter other than the ADV-14. There is a simple expansion ring that is attached to the tail section that allows you to use a bigger tube.

The ADV-15 has a single battery connection. So it could be used with just one 15A/hr NiMH pack or any of the different lead acid packs.


The ADV 15/45 is a little different than the ADV-15. As there is three battery connections inside the scooter. The reason is instead of trying to drive the scooter with a really big 45A/hr NiMH battery pack. It is driven by three individual packs. The electronic have a switch built in. The switch changes automatically between the battery packs while the scooter is operating. So the motor is only drawing from one power source at a given time. The operational benefit is that any one single battery pack connection will not disable the entire scooter.

So yes, you could go from a 15A/hr, 29Kg scooter to a 42A/hr, big cave scooter without much trouble.

Cheers!!

Kevin