alunnewsome(Offline)

Having only joined the forum yesterday, I'm probably putting the cat amongst the pigeons, but hey, if I don't ask I'll never know...

From reading threads posted over the last few months I understand the role of GUE as a training provider of the DIR skill-set and philosophy.

However, within the DIR community is it a requirement to have completed GUE courses to be ‘accepted’? To explain a little more, if someone undertook training with another technical organization (TDI/IANTD etc.), taught by a 'DIR principled' instructor, who introduces and trains them in the use of DIR skills, how 'accepted' by the DIR community would that person be without completing a GUE course?

I'm not looking to start a debate on other organizations training methods or skills, what I'm asking is, would you guys, as DIR divers, dive with other DIR divers who have the skills, but not necessarily the GUE 'tickets'?

I'm curious to better understand what makes a diver 'accepted' DIR.

Cheers

p.s. please don't bite me; I'm only here to learn.
p.p.s. I know most reading this will be working towards/holding GUE certs.

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david_1(Offline)

yes and no :-)

I think any divers prefer to know and understand your level of training, in theory any gue dive could jump in and dive safely with any other gue diver providing they are diving at the level of the least qualified. must be same with other tec / DIR agencys ?

Cyrille(Offline)

Hi,

Let's be clear on the basics:
1. George Irvine III and Jarrod did NOT invent the Hogarthian configuration, else it would be called the "Georgarthian" or the "Jarrodian"...
2. George Irvine III is the father of the "Doing-it-right" motto, YES, that's a fact... He did not invent hot water, but he did good things with scooters.

Now back to Scuba: DIR is a holistic approach, based on a set of principles that reflect common sense and dive experience. It uses the Hogarthian configuration. It is something in the public domain...

NAUI has recently hired the former GUE training director (Andrew Georgitsis) to reshape its diving program. That's an excellent thing, because Andrew is one of the finest divers in the world.

I followed the NTEC course (NAUI Intro to Tec) a year ago, with 3 other divers. The instructor being a NAUI CD (and incidentally at the same time a GUE instructor candidate). A friend of mine who was already GUE certified (DIR-F) came out of curiosity to some of our courses.

At the end his feedback (and the one of the instructor) was that those 2 courses were nearly identical.

I dove with both GUE and NAUI DIR divers and must say that I feel at ease with both. It would be a shame to call someone a "Str*ke" because only the certification agency differs, would it not? Content is the only thing that matters. Competence is to be judged underwater (normally it is not too difficult to identify immediately a genuine DIR diver: trim, boyancy, propulsion techniques, team work, etc) and not on the web.

I hope other training agencies (TDI? CMAS?) will adopt the DIR concept as NAUI already did.

Kind regards.

Cyrille

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reinoud(Offline)

If you are accepted or not of course totally depends on the group.

But I think the proof of the pudding is in the eating. Dive with other group members and let them decide.

But one major thing I read in your post is the constraint on skills. DIR is much, MUCH more than skills and configuration. It is a mindset which is not easily learned from the Internet...

Howard Payne(Offline)

I'll do a shallowish non deco dive with most people who aren't obviously a total window licker.

As it gets deeper - I get fussier. Some people would argue not much fussier - but fussier There are a few non GUE divers I'd do a deeper dive with - but they're in the minority. Its just easier with people who are trained the same way as me. Why make something that's supposed to be fun hard?

Its all here: some of the world's finest Instructors, equipment and buddies.

You've got to want it and be prepared to make the effort - but if this is what you choose - I promise you wont even look back for a moment.

I can't recognise myself as a diver from two years ago. The guys in my team will tell you that if I went on a diet maybe I would

With respect Alun - stop making life hard for yourself - you clearly think this way of diving will suit you - you've got nothing to lose and everything to gain.

If you wanna hit a quarry with one of the guys sometime just say so and either myself or someone a bit closer will be happy to oblige.

HTH

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alunnewsome(Offline)

Cheers to all replying, I must say you all make total sense.

I must admit, although I have observed some DIR divers close up, and been shown some principles; I still have a lot to learn about the intricacies of DIR.

I am in no way trying to ‘shun what GUE training stands for (excellent DIR training to my mind), and I’m not trying to skive off doing a GUE course. I think its awesome advice to just get out there and dive with some DIR divers first, and take some opinion from their observations.

Thanks for balanced, and smart answers :D

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Mal Bridgeman(Offline)

Where are you based Alun?

A number of us occasionally run "Discover DIR" days at UK quarries specifically with the aim of highlighting the kit but moreso the procedures which go with it. A number of people have found it an interesting day out .... a number have then gone on to do a GUE Fundamentals course too.

I don't have any dates in mind for the next one, but if you are interested, let me know and I'll let you know when I schedule the next one.

Best Regards
Mal

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tim(Offline)

I would, yes, for my normal recreational diving - ie, non-deco, <30m diving. My impression was that the DIR guideline was 'don't dive with people who have unsafe attitudes', not 'only dive with people from the same training agency as you'. There is presumably some personal interpretation of 'safe attitude'.

I also dive with lots of other divers who are good buddies and who I would happily trust my wellbeing to. I've been diving with them for years, many of them taught me to dive and are cracking good divers, and I thoroughly enjoy diving with them!

I'd tend to do an OW-level dive to check someone I didn't know at all and make sure they weren't going to scare me into next week.

Tim

Retardboy(Offline)

Things to think about: DIR community, does that consist of GUE trained divers only? Not so.
Can you put = between GUE and DIR and vice versa?
Me think not. Not today.

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LCF(Offline)

I'm one of what I suspect is a small group of people who have taken instruction from GUE instructors and from Andrew-trained non-GUE instructors, and with the exception of a few minor details, the training is the same.

There are DIR organizations that won't allow people on their dives without GUE certs. BAUE is one.

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