Primary light choice

hbatista · August 10th, 2006, 01:36 PM

Hi there

First of all, I'm not a DIR diver, but It's on my plans to become a technical diver and DIR is the philosophy that best fits my values. I want to go to a next level, but just realized I was "putting another dollar in", without really valuing my diving skills and security. But i digress...

I want to buy a primary light, but since i don't want to spend money on something that later won't fill my needs, I'm looking for something which can last some years and be used on technical diving. I would like to cave diving, since we have some at PT. I would like to spend no more than $1200 US / 1000 EUR.

Some of my requisites are:
- warranty, support, spares, reliability. I live at Portugal, and some brands are not represented.
- battery life. 120 Min's is the minimum, but i would like to have something near 200.
- Size and hands free if possible
- charging support. Car charger would be great, but not indispensable. Charging time should not exceed 2,5 hours

I've done some research, and I've seen some models from Halcyon and Agir. Although, I'm a newbie, and maybe I'm going on wrong directions. It would be great if you can advise me some models or brands which i don't know, and any opinions are relevant

thanks, and congratulations for a so dynamic community!
regards

*graham_hk* · August 10th, 2006, 02:00 PM

Get yourself on ebay and find a Pro14 with 18W HID head. They are cheap second hand the batteries are very cheap and available everywhere. It will give you 5h+ burntime which should be enough and you could get another lid and Halogen bulb with is much cheaper to replace and would still give you plenty of light and burntime

Cheers, Graham

maccajim · August 10th, 2006, 02:05 PM

Hey include Salvo lights in your list supposedly pretty tough bulb wise.

I have had a halycon myself for the last 2 years and very happy with it

hbatista · August 10th, 2006, 02:09 PM

Quote: (Originally Posted by maccajim)

Hey include Salvo lights in your list supposedly pretty tough bulb wise.

sorry, but still too newbie to know all the brands.

Considering second hand choices, which factors do you think I should be carefull when buying a second hand one ?

tks!
BTW: this is a great forum.. 2 answers in a so short time is awesome. thanks!

Sterny · August 10th, 2006, 02:11 PM

Quote: (Originally Posted by hbatista)

Some of my requisites are:
- warranty, support, spares, reliability. I live at Portugal, and some brands are not represented.
- battery life. 120 Min's is the minimum, but i would like to have something near 200.
- Size and hands free if possible
- charging support. Car charger would be great, but not indispensable. Charging time should not exceed 2,5 hours

I've done some research, and I've seen some models from Halcyon and Agir.

Hi there H,

Welcome to DIRX, and please do post an introduction!

I'm sure you're going to get loads of replies, but I'll have a quick go:
- Warranty/support: good idea, but hopefully someone else will have a clue about this... I don't
- Battery Life 200 mins+ is easily achievable, though you might not find the brightest torch with a big enough battery within your budget. Our local kit ***** sells a new bright 21W Salvo torch (Salvos are popular and generally a bit cheaper than Halcyon) with a 4.5Ah battery at just over EUR1000 + P&P giving a 120min burn time, or a 9.0Ah battery at just over EUR1160 + P&P giving a 240min burn time, so hopefully prices will be vaguely similar locally to you.
- Size isn't perhaps as important as weight (in water)? The most reliable seem to be ones with Sealed Lead Acid (SLA) batteries, but while cheaper, these are bigger and heavier than Nickle Metal-Hydride (NiMH) batteries. Lithium Ion (LiIon) batteries are fairly new technology in dive torches (though LiIon technology isn't expecially new), and though they are super-light they are also expensive. NiMH seems to be the most popular choice at the moment, with SLA also still popular.
- Hands free?! Erm, if you mean that your hands are still free do to things, i.e. that the lighthead comes with a goodman handle, any of those you mentioned will generally be like that. If you meant head-mounted or somesuch... you're in the wrong place for help there!
- Chargers: Most torches come with mains chargers. I haven't seen a car charger, and I suppose you could probably only use a cheaper one with a SLA battery-powered torch, as NiMH (and LiIon?) torches need more sophisticated chargers with intelligent circuitry in them. A second car charger would be a little bit more expensive for these, and I haven't seen one for sale.
- Charging time not to exceed 2.5 hours: why not? Most of them take a little longer than that (depending on battery capacity and how drained they are, obviously), and my friends and I usually only charge our torches overnight on a dive trip. Does it matter that much if it takes 5-6 hours?

Already mentioned, Salvo is the other make that springs to mind as being especially well suited to DIR.

Welcome again, and hope you enjoy expanding your diving!

David

Sterny · August 10th, 2006, 02:16 PM

Quote: (Originally Posted by graham_hk)

Get yourself on ebay and find a Pro14 with 18W HID head. They are cheap second hand the batteries are very cheap and available everywhere. It will give you 5h+ burntime which should be enough and you could get another lid and Halogen bulb with is much cheaper to replace and would still give you plenty of light and burntime

Cheers, Graham

Also a good option - but Pro14s are HUGE! If that isn't a problem... awesome lights!

hbatista · August 10th, 2006, 02:46 PM

Quote: (Originally Posted by Sterny)

Hi there H,

Welcome to DIRX, and please do post an introduction!

done, sorry for the delay ...

Quote: (Originally Posted by Sterny)

- Size isn't perhaps as important as weight (in water)?

good thought.. so, what should be my main concerns in weight ?

Quote: (Originally Posted by Sterny)

- Hands free?! Erm, if you mean that your hands are still free do to things, i.e. that the lighthead comes with a goodman handle, any of those you mentioned will generally be like that. If you meant head-mounted or somesuch... you're in the wrong place for help there!

i don't mean a bluetooth kit

Yes, i meant a goodman handle. So, normal lights (non umbilical) are generally out of question

Quote: (Originally Posted by Sterny)

Does it matter that much if it takes 5-6 hours?

Well, you got me on this one. After a 200 mins burn time, you won't need it again, and yes i can wait 5-6 hours, so, just forget this.

Txs again.
Btw: do you know any web stores which send halcyon/salvo models to PT ?

vid · August 10th, 2006, 03:02 PM

Quote: (Originally Posted by hbatista)

Btw: do you know any web stores which send halcyon/salvo models to PT ?

hmmm ?

you obviously haven't been reading the archives

Quote: (Originally Posted by Sterny)

Our local kit *****

plus halcyon dealers found at http://www.halcyon.net/dealers/index.shtml

vid

Divingniknaks · August 10th, 2006, 03:32 PM

Quote: (Originally Posted by hbatista)

Btw: do you know any web stores which send halcyon/salvo models to PT ?

Sure, we will ship anywhere in the world

http://www.divingniknaks.com/categories.php?cat=5

Hope that helps.

Cheers

sasdasdaf · August 10th, 2006, 04:02 PM

another vote for second hand pro14/18w. can be found cheap and you will never need another light.

August 10th, 2006, 01:36 PM	#1 (permalink)
hbatista(Offline) New Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Lisbon, PT Posts: 28	Hi there First of all, I'm not a DIR diver, but It's on my plans to become a technical diver and DIR is the philosophy that best fits my values. I want to go to a next level, but just realized I was "putting another dollar in", without really valuing my diving skills and security. But i digress... I want to buy a primary light, but since i don't want to spend money on something that later won't fill my needs, I'm looking for something which can last some years and be used on technical diving. I would like to cave diving, since we have some at PT. I would like to spend no more than $1200 US / 1000 EUR. Some of my requisites are: - warranty, support, spares, reliability. I live at Portugal, and some brands are not represented. - battery life. 120 Min's is the minimum, but i would like to have something near 200. - Size and hands free if possible - charging support. Car charger would be great, but not indispensable. Charging time should not exceed 2,5 hours I've done some research, and I've seen some models from Halcyon and Agir. Although, I'm a newbie, and maybe I'm going on wrong directions. It would be great if you can advise me some models or brands which i don't know, and any opinions are relevant thanks, and congratulations for a so dynamic community! regards Last edited by hbatista; August 10th, 2006 at 03:51 PM..

August 10th, 2006, 02:11 PM	#5 (permalink)
Sterny(Offline) New Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: The limpid tropical lagoons of Ealing, West London Posts: 551	Quote: (Originally Posted by hbatista) Some of my requisites are: - warranty, support, spares, reliability. I live at Portugal, and some brands are not represented. - battery life. 120 Min's is the minimum, but i would like to have something near 200. - Size and hands free if possible - charging support. Car charger would be great, but not indispensable. Charging time should not exceed 2,5 hours I've done some research, and I've seen some models from Halcyon and Agir. Hi there H, Welcome to DIRX, and please do post an introduction! I'm sure you're going to get loads of replies, but I'll have a quick go: - Warranty/support: good idea, but hopefully someone else will have a clue about this... I don't - Battery Life 200 mins+ is easily achievable, though you might not find the brightest torch with a big enough battery within your budget. Our local kit ***** sells a new bright 21W Salvo torch (Salvos are popular and generally a bit cheaper than Halcyon) with a 4.5Ah battery at just over EUR1000 + P&P giving a 120min burn time, or a 9.0Ah battery at just over EUR1160 + P&P giving a 240min burn time, so hopefully prices will be vaguely similar locally to you. - Size isn't perhaps as important as weight (in water)? The most reliable seem to be ones with Sealed Lead Acid (SLA) batteries, but while cheaper, these are bigger and heavier than Nickle Metal-Hydride (NiMH) batteries. Lithium Ion (LiIon) batteries are fairly new technology in dive torches (though LiIon technology isn't expecially new), and though they are super-light they are also expensive. NiMH seems to be the most popular choice at the moment, with SLA also still popular. - Hands free?! Erm, if you mean that your hands are still free do to things, i.e. that the lighthead comes with a goodman handle, any of those you mentioned will generally be like that. If you meant head-mounted or somesuch... you're in the wrong place for help there! - Chargers: Most torches come with mains chargers. I haven't seen a car charger, and I suppose you could probably only use a cheaper one with a SLA battery-powered torch, as NiMH (and LiIon?) torches need more sophisticated chargers with intelligent circuitry in them. A second car charger would be a little bit more expensive for these, and I haven't seen one for sale. - Charging time not to exceed 2.5 hours: why not? Most of them take a little longer than that (depending on battery capacity and how drained they are, obviously), and my friends and I usually only charge our torches overnight on a dive trip. Does it matter that much if it takes 5-6 hours? Already mentioned, Salvo is the other make that springs to mind as being especially well suited to DIR. Welcome again, and hope you enjoy expanding your diving! David __________________ "I thought I had a great idea today, but it never really took off. In fact, it didn't even get on the runway. I guess you could say it exploded in the hangar." - Bill Watterson, Calvin and Hobbes

August 10th, 2006, 02:16 PM	#6 (permalink)
Sterny(Offline) New Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: The limpid tropical lagoons of Ealing, West London Posts: 551	Quote: (Originally Posted by graham_hk) Get yourself on ebay and find a Pro14 with 18W HID head. They are cheap second hand the batteries are very cheap and available everywhere. It will give you 5h+ burntime which should be enough and you could get another lid and Halogen bulb with is much cheaper to replace and would still give you plenty of light and burntime Cheers, Graham Also a good option - but Pro14s are HUGE! If that isn't a problem... awesome lights! __________________ "I thought I had a great idea today, but it never really took off. In fact, it didn't even get on the runway. I guess you could say it exploded in the hangar." - Bill Watterson, Calvin and Hobbes

August 10th, 2006, 03:32 PM	#9 (permalink)
Divingniknaks(Offline) Resident purveyor of shiney kit.... Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Midlands UK Posts: 1,040	Quote: (Originally Posted by hbatista) Btw: do you know any web stores which send halcyon/salvo models to PT ? Sure, we will ship anywhere in the world http://www.divingniknaks.com/categories.php?cat=5 Hope that helps. Cheers __________________ Phill ----------------------------- Salvo Lights, DirZone Gear , Frog Wings Dive ? http://www.divingniknaks.com

August 10th, 2006, 02:00 PM	#2 (permalink)
graham_hk(Offline) GUE instructor Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Asia Posts: 1,112	Get yourself on ebay and find a Pro14 with 18W HID head. They are cheap second hand the batteries are very cheap and available everywhere. It will give you 5h+ burntime which should be enough and you could get another lid and Halogen bulb with is much cheaper to replace and would still give you plenty of light and burntime Cheers, Graham

August 10th, 2006, 02:05 PM	#3 (permalink)
maccajim(Offline) New Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Sydney Posts: 99	Hey include Salvo lights in your list supposedly pretty tough bulb wise. I have had a halycon myself for the last 2 years and very happy with it

August 10th, 2006, 02:09 PM	#4 (permalink)
hbatista(Offline) New Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Lisbon, PT Posts: 28	Quote: (Originally Posted by maccajim) Hey include Salvo lights in your list supposedly pretty tough bulb wise. sorry, but still too newbie to know all the brands. Considering second hand choices, which factors do you think I should be carefull when buying a second hand one ? tks! BTW: this is a great forum.. 2 answers in a so short time is awesome. thanks!

August 10th, 2006, 02:46 PM	#7 (permalink)
hbatista(Offline) New Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Lisbon, PT Posts: 28	Quote: (Originally Posted by Sterny) Hi there H, Welcome to DIRX, and please do post an introduction! done, sorry for the delay ... Quote: (Originally Posted by Sterny) - Size isn't perhaps as important as weight (in water)? good thought.. so, what should be my main concerns in weight ? Quote: (Originally Posted by Sterny) - Hands free?! Erm, if you mean that your hands are still free do to things, i.e. that the lighthead comes with a goodman handle, any of those you mentioned will generally be like that. If you meant head-mounted or somesuch... you're in the wrong place for help there! i don't mean a bluetooth kit Yes, i meant a goodman handle. So, normal lights (non umbilical) are generally out of question Quote: (Originally Posted by Sterny) Does it matter that much if it takes 5-6 hours? Well, you got me on this one. After a 200 mins burn time, you won't need it again, and yes i can wait 5-6 hours, so, just forget this. Txs again. Btw: do you know any web stores which send halcyon/salvo models to PT ?

August 10th, 2006, 03:02 PM	#8 (permalink)
vid(Offline) New Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: london/surrey border, UK Posts: 356	Quote: (Originally Posted by hbatista) Btw: do you know any web stores which send halcyon/salvo models to PT ? hmmm ? you obviously haven't been reading the archives Quote: (Originally Posted by Sterny) Our local kit ***** plus halcyon dealers found at http://www.halcyon.net/dealers/index.shtml vid

August 10th, 2006, 04:02 PM	#10 (permalink)
sasdasdaf(Offline) New Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Hong Kong Posts: 420	another vote for second hand pro14/18w. can be found cheap and you will never need another light.