Halcyon BC cons

TobyFish · May 23rd, 2006, 12:54 AM

Really interested in Halcyon eclipse 36 but have seen this (minimalist) review

http://www.divernet.com/equipment/wings2004/index.shtml

I am concerned that the author thinks the harness is hard to adjust... I would need to adjust between cold weather and wetsuit configs regularly

Also concerned if buoyancy is really concentrated at top of unit... this would be a step backwards from my ProQD jacket which has all buoyancy below armpits... (which also puts it in the same place as the weight and allows good trim control)

any comments on this review?

jasonmh · May 23rd, 2006, 01:11 AM

Hi,
Just thought I'd throw in a few things:
1- there is no Eclipse 36.. there is a 30# and 40# version
2- The harness is not that hard to adjust. At first it may seem so, but after doing it a few times I could easily adjust it in a couple minutes max. It is easier if you mark the webbing for your sizing for different suits, then you can just move the tri-glides to the appropriate location on the webbing for a given suit. Or, eventually I just got 2 harnesses, one for warm water and one for cold (3 mil and drysuit). Then you can use the same wing and STA, but just put on which ever harness fits your exposure suit. After having done it myself I felt that being able to change sizes quickly was overrated. IMO, it is rare that you will need to vary your exposure suit from one dive to the next. I usually only have to change mine when I travel to warmer water.
3- It is definitely not a step backwards in regards to trim, esp. not when compared to a jacket.

And I think the review was well off-base on several points.

HTH,
Jason

limeyx · May 23rd, 2006, 01:26 AM

Quote: (Originally Posted by TobyFish)

Really interested in Halcyon eclipse 36 but have seen this (minimalist) review

http://www.divernet.com/equipment/wings2004/index.shtml

I am concerned that the author thinks the harness is hard to adjust... I would need to adjust between cold weather and wetsuit configs regularly

Also concerned if buoyancy is really concentrated at top of unit... this would be a step backwards from my ProQD jacket which has all buoyancy below armpits... (which also puts it in the same place as the weight and allows good trim control)

any comments on this review?

Generally I am able to use the same settings for wetsuit and drysuit. I dive in a 7MM wetsuit and a TLS350 with 300G fleece undergarment.

I guess it's a bit loose on the wetsuit, but not anything that makes too much difference to me. I even used it with a 3MM wetsuit and it seemed OK.

StephenT · May 23rd, 2006, 01:36 AM

ye cause my understand of dir diving is that all air is dumped the "old fashioned way" through the corrugated hose, and not through the back dump?

Seydlitz · May 23rd, 2006, 01:38 AM

Not sure if the author is a fan of DIR style Equipment Mr JB..Yes a one piece harness does take a little time to set up however ,once its set up its set up no more tinkering...

Amphibious1 · May 23rd, 2006, 01:58 AM

I just purchased an Eclipe 30# from EE last week and dove it a couple of hours later at Ginnie. The buoyancy was distributed nicely, and kept me in a nice horizontal position. The harness needs to be adjusted properly, but this is easy and once done, as stated above, it does not need to be tinkered with.

I was even able to affect an adjustment on my girlfriends harness while in the waist deep water just beyond the stairs. You would not be dissapointed IMO.

Chris

LCF · May 23rd, 2006, 06:57 AM

The one-piece harness is not unique to Halcyon. I have an Oxycheq plate with the continuous harness. It takes me about five minutes to adjust the harness to go from my dry suit with tons of undergarment to my 3 mil wetsuit, which I do whenever we take a warm water trip. I will say that switching to the Halcyon harness webbing made it even easier.

TobyFish · May 23rd, 2006, 11:56 AM

Quote: (Originally Posted by Amphibious1)

I was even able to affect an adjustment on my girlfriends harness while in the waist deep water just beyond the stairs.

??? Maybe your girlfriend should move house to somewhere off of the flood plain! then she wouldn't need a hog rig to go down stairs.

Re: 30/36/40 wings, I see them advertised as 30 or 40 most places, but 36 elsewhere - maybe they are quoting 36 as the net lift after taking into account supplied backplate and STA - or they're just plain wrong. Anyhow, considering the larger one as I dive steel 15L tanks

thanks for all the info guys... all very helpful again

Joe Hesketh · May 23rd, 2006, 12:43 PM

Quote: (Originally Posted by TobyFish)

Re: 30/36/40 wings, I see them advertised as 30 or 40 most places, but 36 elsewhere

The Pioneer comes in 27 and 36lb versions. The Eclipse is 30 and 40lb.

GoDiva · May 23rd, 2006, 02:15 PM

I have the Pioneer 36 lbs (older version, without STA needed), and am happy with it. Perhaps slightly to big for diving in the tropics, but definately useable.

I hardly have to adjust the harness. I did not change it on my trip when I used a 3(+3 sometimes) mm wet suit from my own 7+5 mm suit. It was slightly to loose at the end, but that might have had something to do with losing 7 kg... .

It needed some adjusting to comfortably dive it with a compressed neopreen dry suit with lots of underclothes this winter, and I expect it will be tightened again during fundies in 2 days time.

A great advantage of a wing is that it is easy when travelling. It does not take up as much room as a conventional jacket. I would consider an alu backplate with webbing next time I go to warmer waters: it would save adjusting it, and I would not be too overweighted (I used 2 kg in salt water in the Philippines, and that was still slightly too much).

oh, and forgot to say: I tend to use the dump valve for trim as my dir-buddies have taught me. Never felt the need for extra valves or releases, beside the bottom dump valve and inflator button.

May 23rd, 2006, 12:54 AM	#1 (permalink)
TobyFish(Offline) Fine Upstanding Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Telford, UK Posts: 791	Halcyon BC cons Really interested in Halcyon eclipse 36 but have seen this (minimalist) review http://www.divernet.com/equipment/wings2004/index.shtml I am concerned that the author thinks the harness is hard to adjust... I would need to adjust between cold weather and wetsuit configs regularly Also concerned if buoyancy is really concentrated at top of unit... this would be a step backwards from my ProQD jacket which has all buoyancy below armpits... (which also puts it in the same place as the weight and allows good trim control) any comments on this review?

May 23rd, 2006, 01:11 AM	#2 (permalink)
jasonmh(Offline) New Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: New Mexico Posts: 125	Hi, Just thought I'd throw in a few things: 1- there is no Eclipse 36.. there is a 30# and 40# version 2- The harness is not that hard to adjust. At first it may seem so, but after doing it a few times I could easily adjust it in a couple minutes max. It is easier if you mark the webbing for your sizing for different suits, then you can just move the tri-glides to the appropriate location on the webbing for a given suit. Or, eventually I just got 2 harnesses, one for warm water and one for cold (3 mil and drysuit). Then you can use the same wing and STA, but just put on which ever harness fits your exposure suit. After having done it myself I felt that being able to change sizes quickly was overrated. IMO, it is rare that you will need to vary your exposure suit from one dive to the next. I usually only have to change mine when I travel to warmer water. 3- It is definitely not a step backwards in regards to trim, esp. not when compared to a jacket. And I think the review was well off-base on several points. HTH, Jason Last edited by jasonmh; May 23rd, 2006 at 01:13 AM.

May 23rd, 2006, 01:38 AM	#5 (permalink)
Seydlitz(Offline) New Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Never Far from a good Belgian Beer and a Crackwh*re Posts: 455	Unbiased Not sure if the author is a fan of DIR style Equipment Mr JB..Yes a one piece harness does take a little time to set up however ,once its set up its set up no more tinkering...

May 23rd, 2006, 01:26 AM	#3 (permalink)
limeyx(Offline) New Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 707	Quote: (Originally Posted by TobyFish) Really interested in Halcyon eclipse 36 but have seen this (minimalist) review http://www.divernet.com/equipment/wings2004/index.shtml I am concerned that the author thinks the harness is hard to adjust... I would need to adjust between cold weather and wetsuit configs regularly Also concerned if buoyancy is really concentrated at top of unit... this would be a step backwards from my ProQD jacket which has all buoyancy below armpits... (which also puts it in the same place as the weight and allows good trim control) any comments on this review? Generally I am able to use the same settings for wetsuit and drysuit. I dive in a 7MM wetsuit and a TLS350 with 300G fleece undergarment. I guess it's a bit loose on the wetsuit, but not anything that makes too much difference to me. I even used it with a 3MM wetsuit and it seemed OK.

May 23rd, 2006, 01:36 AM	#4 (permalink)
StephenT(Offline) New Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Tynemouth Posts: 108	ye cause my understand of dir diving is that all air is dumped the "old fashioned way" through the corrugated hose, and not through the back dump?

May 23rd, 2006, 01:58 AM	#6 (permalink)
Amphibious1(Offline) New Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Tampa Fl. Posts: 1	I just purchased an Eclipe 30# from EE last week and dove it a couple of hours later at Ginnie. The buoyancy was distributed nicely, and kept me in a nice horizontal position. The harness needs to be adjusted properly, but this is easy and once done, as stated above, it does not need to be tinkered with. I was even able to affect an adjustment on my girlfriends harness while in the waist deep water just beyond the stairs. You would not be dissapointed IMO. Chris

May 23rd, 2006, 06:57 AM	#7 (permalink)
LCF(Offline) New Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Seattle Posts: 622	The one-piece harness is not unique to Halcyon. I have an Oxycheq plate with the continuous harness. It takes me about five minutes to adjust the harness to go from my dry suit with tons of undergarment to my 3 mil wetsuit, which I do whenever we take a warm water trip. I will say that switching to the Halcyon harness webbing made it even easier.

May 23rd, 2006, 11:56 AM	#8 (permalink)
TobyFish(Offline) Fine Upstanding Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Telford, UK Posts: 791	Quote: (Originally Posted by Amphibious1) I was even able to affect an adjustment on my girlfriends harness while in the waist deep water just beyond the stairs. ??? Maybe your girlfriend should move house to somewhere off of the flood plain! then she wouldn't need a hog rig to go down stairs. Re: 30/36/40 wings, I see them advertised as 30 or 40 most places, but 36 elsewhere - maybe they are quoting 36 as the net lift after taking into account supplied backplate and STA - or they're just plain wrong. Anyhow, considering the larger one as I dive steel 15L tanks thanks for all the info guys... all very helpful again

May 23rd, 2006, 12:43 PM	#9 (permalink)
Joe Hesketh (Online) New Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: London, UK Posts: 657	Quote: (Originally Posted by TobyFish) Re: 30/36/40 wings, I see them advertised as 30 or 40 most places, but 36 elsewhere The Pioneer comes in 27 and 36lb versions. The Eclipse is 30 and 40lb.

May 23rd, 2006, 02:15 PM	#10 (permalink)
GoDiva(Offline) New Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Belgium Posts: 540	I have the Pioneer 36 lbs (older version, without STA needed), and am happy with it. Perhaps slightly to big for diving in the tropics, but definately useable. I hardly have to adjust the harness. I did not change it on my trip when I used a 3(+3 sometimes) mm wet suit from my own 7+5 mm suit. It was slightly to loose at the end, but that might have had something to do with losing 7 kg... . It needed some adjusting to comfortably dive it with a compressed neopreen dry suit with lots of underclothes this winter, and I expect it will be tightened again during fundies in 2 days time. A great advantage of a wing is that it is easy when travelling. It does not take up as much room as a conventional jacket. I would consider an alu backplate with webbing next time I go to warmer waters: it would save adjusting it, and I would not be too overweighted (I used 2 kg in salt water in the Philippines, and that was still slightly too much). oh, and forgot to say: I tend to use the dump valve for trim as my dir-buddies have taught me. Never felt the need for extra valves or releases, beside the bottom dump valve and inflator button.