Settle The Argument about DIR

mattler · May 20th, 2006, 03:49 AM

I`m slightly confused now after testing the water about DIR, after speaking to a friend I was under the impression that I would be DIR if I bought a Halcyon wing. I realise that I wouldn`t become an instant expert but I thought that this particular wing was the first qualification into DIR diving. The guy didn`t say that theres actually a course that I can attend. Is my mate wrong about the Halcyon wing then??? If so, do I need to sell it on and buy another wing to suit the DIR style?

corey d · May 20th, 2006, 06:27 AM

come on dude, are you serious?

cd

Noel Johnson · May 20th, 2006, 08:14 AM

Okay, I'll bite...

Halcyon equipment is very nice and DIR compliant, ie it fulfills the required performance issues for DIR dive kit, another manufacturer for off the peg wings etc are AGIR, however you can make up your own stuff as long as it sits in "the rules"

Simply buying the stuff does not make you qualified in DIR, it would be akin to going into your local automobile emporium and buying an Imprezza - would this make you a qualified rally driver? I think not. It may well put you on the path to becoming one but there would be a lot of training end experience required before you can be one.

The first step to true DIR is to do the fundamentals course (DIR-F) then, and only then, are you a true DIR diver.

I hope this helps and good luck,

Noel.

LCF · May 20th, 2006, 08:21 AM

I'm going to make an assumption, based on your prior posts, that you are sincere but misguided.

DIR is a whole approach to diving. Equipment is a part of it, but it prescribes a certain TYPE of equipment, not a brand or brands. My Fundies instructor never mentioned any brands at all. He just looked at our equipment and told us where it was optimal and where it was not. He didn't even tell any of us we couldn't USE what we had. He just pointed out why the DIR paradigm said it was not the best choice we could make, all things being equal.

But DIR is so much more than gear. You need to amass the basic required equipment . . . but you can even begin to work toward DIR diving before you have a backplate and wing. DIR is about team diving. It's about putting together a team (two or three) that can do the proposed dive in harmony and cooperation, safely, and have fun doing it. To do that, you need some degree of standardization of equipment so that you all understand what each diver has -- because each diver's equipment is the team's equipment. And because each team member has to be able to help the other.

You need good skills, because you can't be a strong team member if you are a weak diver. That lesson I learned from personal experience, early on in my DIR journey.

And you need awareness and a strong team ethic. This is the biggest thing you get from the Fundies class -- that glimpse into what diving as a team means. And it's a glimpse, because it's clear to me from reading the reports of people who have gone on that this idea developed and strengthens as you continue in your training. I will say that the relationship I have built with my DIR practice buddy has made him simply the most enjoyable companion for diving that I have. Even for simple, fun dives, it is so apparent we are on the same wavelength and approach everything the same way.

I think you are sincere in your interest. I hope so. This is a wonderful way to dive. It has nothing to do with brands of gear, and everything to do with a well-constructed, thoughtful system of diving that makes it more fun, whether you are single tank fish freaks like me and my partner, or heavy-duty technical wreck divers like the English group on this BB.

Devon Rob · May 20th, 2006, 09:44 AM

@ Noel....man I think your Avatar deserves a prize!!! ROFL

mattler · May 20th, 2006, 08:05 PM

Quote: (Originally Posted by Devon Rob)

@ Noel....man I think your Avatar deserves a prize!!! ROFL

I pratted about trying you get it soted but the system wouldn`t allow me to insert it, still trying!!

mattler · May 20th, 2006, 08:15 PM

Quote: (Originally Posted by corey d)

come on dude, are you serious?

cd

YES! I am serious, I`m seriously trying to gather information which I can use to build my knowledge on DIR so hopefully one day my skills will be on a par with the likes of yourself. I only hope that when the day comes, I will be a little bit more patient with newcomers like myself who will make mistakes and get supplied with inacurate information!!!

NickB · May 20th, 2006, 08:28 PM

Quote: (Originally Posted by mattler)

YES! I am serious, I`m seriously trying to gather information which I can use to build my knowledge on DIR so hopefully one day my skills will be on a par with the likes of yourself. I only hope that when the day comes, I will be a little bit more patient with newcomers like myself who will make mistakes and get supplied with inacurate information!!!

C'mon Mattler, chill a bit mate. Like Corey, I thought your post had 'Troll' written all over it.

cantinadiver · May 20th, 2006, 08:30 PM

Quote: (Originally Posted by mattler)

YES! I am serious, I`m seriously trying to gather information which I can use to build my knowledge on DIR so hopefully one day my skills will be on a par with the likes of yourself. I only hope that when the day comes, I will be a little bit more patient with newcomers like myself who will make mistakes and get supplied with inacurate information!!!

don't take it the wrong way- spend a little more time on these boards and you'll come to realise that there's more than a few people out there that like to make posts similar to yours just to stir things up. While i'm sure you're sincere I had to make a double take as it spelled out TROLL to me the first time I read it.

Davey Willo · May 20th, 2006, 08:48 PM

Same Here, my first thought on reading the post was "Oh No here we go again!".. and to tell the truth I'm still not 100% certain, but hey I'm certainly willing to give the benefit of the doubt.

Mattler, I see that you're from my home town of Redcar, I'm currently 15 minutes away in Ingleby Barwick near Yarm, if you're really serious and really want to learn about the DIR system then I'm very willing to meet up and try to help you gain a greater understanding of the whole concept.

I have plenty of books, powerpoint slides and DVD's which will help, we can even go diving together if you wish and I'll demonstrate the expected and required skill sets as well as explain the why's and wherefore's of the Hogarthian rigs that we dive.

If you're up for it then please feel free to contact me on 07969 436920

regards
Dave.

May 20th, 2006, 03:49 AM	#1 (permalink)
mattler(Offline) New Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Redcar N/E Coast Posts: 17	Settle The Argument about DIR I`m slightly confused now after testing the water about DIR, after speaking to a friend I was under the impression that I would be DIR if I bought a Halcyon wing. I realise that I wouldn`t become an instant expert but I thought that this particular wing was the first qualification into DIR diving. The guy didn`t say that theres actually a course that I can attend. Is my mate wrong about the Halcyon wing then??? If so, do I need to sell it on and buy another wing to suit the DIR style?

May 20th, 2006, 08:14 AM	#3 (permalink)
Noel Johnson(Offline) New Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Burton-upon-Trent Posts: 64	Okay, I'll bite... Halcyon equipment is very nice and DIR compliant, ie it fulfills the required performance issues for DIR dive kit, another manufacturer for off the peg wings etc are AGIR, however you can make up your own stuff as long as it sits in "the rules" Simply buying the stuff does not make you qualified in DIR, it would be akin to going into your local automobile emporium and buying an Imprezza - would this make you a qualified rally driver? I think not. It may well put you on the path to becoming one but there would be a lot of training end experience required before you can be one. The first step to true DIR is to do the fundamentals course (DIR-F) then, and only then, are you a true DIR diver. I hope this helps and good luck, Noel. __________________ Team Bunny. Depth before Dishonour.

May 20th, 2006, 09:44 AM	#5 (permalink)
Devon Rob(Offline) Can´t remember-member Breakout Champion! Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Lyme Bay.Devon.UK formerly Hamburg, Ger. Posts: 316	@ Noel....man I think your Avatar deserves a prize!!! ROFL __________________ this mail was checked for viruses,worms & bad breath

May 20th, 2006, 08:15 PM	#7 (permalink)
mattler(Offline) New Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Redcar N/E Coast Posts: 17	Encouraging Develpoment Quote: (Originally Posted by corey d) come on dude, are you serious? cd YES! I am serious, I`m seriously trying to gather information which I can use to build my knowledge on DIR so hopefully one day my skills will be on a par with the likes of yourself. I only hope that when the day comes, I will be a little bit more patient with newcomers like myself who will make mistakes and get supplied with inacurate information!!!

May 20th, 2006, 08:28 PM	#8 (permalink)
NickB (Online) Always lowering the tone Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Cardiff, UK Posts: 340	Quote: (Originally Posted by mattler) YES! I am serious, I`m seriously trying to gather information which I can use to build my knowledge on DIR so hopefully one day my skills will be on a par with the likes of yourself. I only hope that when the day comes, I will be a little bit more patient with newcomers like myself who will make mistakes and get supplied with inacurate information!!! C'mon Mattler, chill a bit mate. Like Corey, I thought your post had 'Troll' written all over it. __________________ SnowHeads / BreastFriends / Free Money!

May 20th, 2006, 06:27 AM	#2 (permalink)
corey d(Offline) New Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: South Louisiana USA Posts: 14	come on dude, are you serious? cd

May 20th, 2006, 08:21 AM	#4 (permalink)
LCF(Offline) New Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Seattle Posts: 622	I'm going to make an assumption, based on your prior posts, that you are sincere but misguided. DIR is a whole approach to diving. Equipment is a part of it, but it prescribes a certain TYPE of equipment, not a brand or brands. My Fundies instructor never mentioned any brands at all. He just looked at our equipment and told us where it was optimal and where it was not. He didn't even tell any of us we couldn't USE what we had. He just pointed out why the DIR paradigm said it was not the best choice we could make, all things being equal. But DIR is so much more than gear. You need to amass the basic required equipment . . . but you can even begin to work toward DIR diving before you have a backplate and wing. DIR is about team diving. It's about putting together a team (two or three) that can do the proposed dive in harmony and cooperation, safely, and have fun doing it. To do that, you need some degree of standardization of equipment so that you all understand what each diver has -- because each diver's equipment is the team's equipment. And because each team member has to be able to help the other. You need good skills, because you can't be a strong team member if you are a weak diver. That lesson I learned from personal experience, early on in my DIR journey. And you need awareness and a strong team ethic. This is the biggest thing you get from the Fundies class -- that glimpse into what diving as a team means. And it's a glimpse, because it's clear to me from reading the reports of people who have gone on that this idea developed and strengthens as you continue in your training. I will say that the relationship I have built with my DIR practice buddy has made him simply the most enjoyable companion for diving that I have. Even for simple, fun dives, it is so apparent we are on the same wavelength and approach everything the same way. I think you are sincere in your interest. I hope so. This is a wonderful way to dive. It has nothing to do with brands of gear, and everything to do with a well-constructed, thoughtful system of diving that makes it more fun, whether you are single tank fish freaks like me and my partner, or heavy-duty technical wreck divers like the English group on this BB.

May 20th, 2006, 08:05 PM	#6 (permalink)
mattler(Offline) New Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Redcar N/E Coast Posts: 17	Quote: (Originally Posted by Devon Rob) @ Noel....man I think your Avatar deserves a prize!!! ROFL I pratted about trying you get it soted but the system wouldn`t allow me to insert it, still trying!!

May 20th, 2006, 08:30 PM	#9 (permalink)
cantinadiver(Offline) New Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: British Columbia Posts: 39	Quote: (Originally Posted by mattler) YES! I am serious, I`m seriously trying to gather information which I can use to build my knowledge on DIR so hopefully one day my skills will be on a par with the likes of yourself. I only hope that when the day comes, I will be a little bit more patient with newcomers like myself who will make mistakes and get supplied with inacurate information!!! don't take it the wrong way- spend a little more time on these boards and you'll come to realise that there's more than a few people out there that like to make posts similar to yours just to stir things up. While i'm sure you're sincere I had to make a double take as it spelled out TROLL to me the first time I read it.

May 20th, 2006, 08:48 PM	#10 (permalink)
Davey Willo(Offline) New Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Cleveland Posts: 197	Same Here, my first thought on reading the post was "Oh No here we go again!".. and to tell the truth I'm still not 100% certain, but hey I'm certainly willing to give the benefit of the doubt. Mattler, I see that you're from my home town of Redcar, I'm currently 15 minutes away in Ingleby Barwick near Yarm, if you're really serious and really want to learn about the DIR system then I'm very willing to meet up and try to help you gain a greater understanding of the whole concept. I have plenty of books, powerpoint slides and DVD's which will help, we can even go diving together if you wish and I'll demonstrate the expected and required skill sets as well as explain the why's and wherefore's of the Hogarthian rigs that we dive. If you're up for it then please feel free to contact me on 07969 436920 regards Dave.